# The Good Wife S4 E15

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Welcome to the Good Pod, where today we're talking The Good Wife, season four, episode 15, going for the Gold. I'm one of your hosts, Jason Reed. With me as always, a woman that I would never try to cut off at the knees. Mar Garza Mar. You good? You little sneak? I'm good. I am good. I just would like the listeners to know that pre pod we were talking about that show all her faults that was on the Hulu.

Or something, the peacock one of those. And how the main character's name is Marissa and she's called Mar. And no one has ever called me Mar. And I don't, I did not like the sound of Mar. Um, so that's where that is coming from. Jason, are you good? I'm good, Mar. I'm great. It's good to talk to you again. Why?

Why did I say anything? It's good to see you in this, uh, new Year of Yes. Of our Lord or Satan, one or [00:01:00] the other. Uh, 2026. Our entity, our being. Yeah. Someone's controlling this and we don't know who we would like them to stop, please. Uh, we are here three days. Yes. Give us a, give us a break. Give us a break.

Here we are season, we're ha a little, almost to the end of season four, I think. Almost, almost. Yeah. We kind of, we kind of going going fast. We're, I'm just remember the other day, we're starting season four, so, uh, here we are. Yeah, fun episode. Really fun. Uh, you know, it's always fun. We got a ellizabeth joint going on, uh, and it seems like this, uh, for the time being Ellsworth might be out of our orbit, but, um, you know, it's, it's good to have her here when the Ellizabeth show is on hiatus, uh, in the real time that we're recording this.

Yes. Um, but, uh, before we get into everything, let's, uh, go through some, some free and easy ways. You, as a listener slash viewer can help this podcast. You can do that by reviewing, rating, subscribing, wherever it is you are watching. We're listening right now. Uh, that would be a great [00:02:00] help to us. It, uh, helps to get to the eyes and ears of more listeners.

You can also email us at the good pod feedback@gmail.com. If you just want to chop it up with us about the show, uh, anytime, give your thoughts, opinions about things. Uh, if you also wanna help us monetarily, you can also do that. Through the, uh, buy me a coffee link at buy me a coffee.com/good pod. There you can, uh, you know, donate sums small and large.

We love the large, we also like the small, so anything you can do to help us would be great. Uh, special shout out to Laura Morrison, uh, who just donated over at Buy Me a Coffee not too long ago. Uh, Laura, you, you commented, I love your commentary as much as the shows you cover. Thanks for the hours of entertainment you provide.

Thank you, Laura, for being yeah. Uh, being one of our most like, you know, passionate listeners slash viewers. Uh, we great. Greatly appreciate it. Uh, so yeah, with all that outta the way, Marissa, let's, uh, let's dive to the episode, shall we? Oh boy. Yeah, we got a lot going on. Uh, the case of the week, this week was actually Eli's case again.

We thought this was done. Um, [00:03:00] but we see Josh Perotti, AKA Mr. Twin, twin Peaks. Um. Like so excited to meet Elba for lunch. He's like, oh my gosh, I'm so glad you called. Also, we're meeting at this like Indonesian Indian restaurant and also we're gonna sit on the same side of the table, and also I've ordered for you and Elba is like, this is a working lunch.

Okay. I think it's so interesting that they, they cast someone to be almost as quirky and weird and interesting as Ellsworth to kind of give her a run for her money. I was like, we, we've never really seen Ellsworth, like really caught off guard a lot. Really like Unbalanced. And Josh is someone that can't do that because he's so, he's so forward.

He's, he's so weird that, but not like, not like a, he, he, he, he blurs out line between like. Uh, forward and creepy. Like, he's like, he's like, not, not quite as creepy. He's almost there, but he's not. You can tell. Um, [00:04:00] like there's definitely some like sexual harassment in this conversation that happened. I mean, he's, he's, he's walking up to the door of sexual, he's like, he's like, he's like lightly, he's like light, almost lightly tapping that door of like sexual, like we stop short, stop short.

Um, um, I actually had a, this happened to me like that, that comment, and I actually put it through. Which comment? Which comment though? Which comment? The, your lips are so pillowy. Oh yeah, yeah, that one. I've got that, that's, I've forgot that specific line. That's one that's not great. That's definitely not, not great.

That one, one was not fun. But I mean, it, it's also like a, this is again, before Me too, all this stuff. I'm sure when I was watching this, uh, in real time, I was like, oh my gosh, that's too funny. But Ellizabeth is clearly uncomfortable with this entire setup from the beginning. She's just like, yeah, uh, I wasn't expecting this.

And also I'm not hungry. And also I just wanna tell you like, Hey, [00:05:00] I see you talking in the papers. I see you bringing this, you know, seeing that there's more here. So what is it like, just tell me what's going on. I guess. I guess I was kind of reading this as like, I was reading this as she was kind of tempted to be honest.

I was like, I don't think she knows. Like, I think there's times she goes back and forth, back and forth, um. One thing, I do have a question for the kings. We, whoever talked to them is, was Josh Perotti ever a firefighter? Yeah, exactly. Because this was very firefighter slash elsbeth behavior. If you are a watcher of sba, that makes sense.

But one of the things that Elsbeth does in that show is like firefighters love redhead. Like, and she can't, she's entire, her entire life she's had to deal with like firefighters Yeah. Coming after her. And in that show, anytime you come up, uh, we come up, uh, against a firefighter or firefighters involved, they're always into Elsbeth.

Yeah. So that's, that's the thing on the Elsbeth show. So that would be funny to find out that Josh had a, a previous career in firefighting, but it was definitely like a similar vibe from that of what we've [00:06:00] seen on the, on the Elsbeth show. But the, the issue here is he's out there talking in the processing.

Like Eli's case isn't over. I have more stuff. About this, like, um, what is it? And he's like, don't worry. Like don't worry. I have figured it out. It's conspiracy. Aren't I So smart? Like, he's like, aren't you impressed? Yeah. Aren't you impressed in me? Because I figured out conspiracy. And he is like, she's like, okay, well what's the discovery on this?

And he's like, well, I'm not gonna give it to you. You could take me to court. He's like, oh, I can't wait till you take me to court. She's like, oh, okay. Well I'm gonna go now. Thanks so much. Noted. She only has one tote bag in her possession. She does. She does, but she does have something in that tote bag that she pulled out.

So that was a win. Oh yeah, it's true. Very true. You know, and you know, this, this gets con, this gets revealed as like, because there's a gossip column that Petra Moritz, uh, yes. Is who We met Petra before. I know. She was like the, the reporter, the have it all reporter that like, you know, does all the stuff.

[00:07:00] Even so much so that she's moderating the debate later in this, in the episode. I'm like, wow, Petra is really a, uh, do all for all reporter slash uh, there's, there's only one bar in Chicago and there's only one reporter in Chicago also. I guess so, so like, this is like kind of a gossip colony thing of like he was found talking to somebody in a restaurant about the Eli Gold stuff.

We don't know who that is quite yet. And that's what, that's what Ellsworth wants to know who is, who is the co-conspirator. You are saying that Eli bought these votes with Yes. Okay. Yes. And so Josh was like, I'm not gonna tell you you're gonna have to take me to court. And Colin was like, all right, but.

Hey, Kalinda, you wanna help me with something? And we finally get to see this pairing between Kalinda and sba, trying to do like some investigative work together. 'cause Elba is pretty good investigator on her own. Um, and so she's like trying to compare notes with Kalinda. Like, what do you do? How do you plan's?

Like, I don't have a plan. Like I just elba like, what do you mean you don't have a plan? She's like, I don't have a [00:08:00] plan. Let's find out what happens. So they're at the restaurant that apparently Josh had a, had a lunch meeting with someone and they wanted find out who that meeting was with. And so Lin's whole promise here is, hi, I'm Josh's assistant.

And he wanted to give his number to the weight person who took care of them on a personal matter, but can't remember the name of the weight person. And in the back Elba is like loving this giggling. Yes. Literally giggling. I was like, Elsa, this is not gonna work out. If you keep giggling, they're gonna know something is up.

And I don't know if you caught this, but the, the person, the, the hostess. It's like the hostess also has like a, like British accent. Yeah. She slipped into an accent. Yeah. And I felt like, I also felt like the RG Punjabi was like upping the English accent as well in the moment. I was like, is this like an English R?

What's going on here? Uh, she's like, oh, we, we need to find out the waits person that was, uh, that, that I can't do it. British accent apparently right now to save my life. Um, but I was like, first of all, who says wait person? I don't know. [00:09:00] It was weird to me in the, in the, in the accent. I was like, the wait person.

Yeah. I was like, okay, cool. And you know, I, I, I would've liked, 'cause you know, every woman that Kalinda meets has to be into Kalinda. So I was, I, I feel like they should have worked, used that a little bit because the story that Kalinda is spinning here was just like. What, what are you talking about? Like, I would've preferred that the, the, that the hostess is just like a Nick.

Linda was willing to give her anything besides giving this cock and make me story like, uh, the, uh, the guy wanted, uh, Josh wanted to give the wait person his number for a personal reason, and we just need to figure out who that was. And we figured out who else, who that was by who Josh was having dinner with.

Now what if the reservation was made in Josh's name? Then we'd be up the creek, right? Yeah, yeah. But it wasn't Jason. It wasn't, we were able to find out that this was a reservation under the name of Frank Lando, head of the DND. So next thing we see is a very mad Eli walking down the street trying to confront Frank in front of the DMC offices.

And Frank's like. [00:10:00] Yo bro, like they're coming after me. What do you, what do, what would you do in my situation? And then he says to Eli, like, I don't know you and Eli swaps the keys out of Frank's hand. Oh God, I don't know you. This never happened. I don't know you. I'm just gonna go in, I'm gonna do my job.

And that's it. And Eli is not happy. Well, Eli says, like, Frank, whatever I did wrong, I did it. You're prompting. I was like, oh, okay. Interesting. Uh, that, I mean, that's kind of an admission from Eli that he, he's done some, some shady stuff. Uh, probably, you know, as he says, ask Frank. Frank has threatened Eli a lot of times of like, we're gonna pull funding, we're gonna pull all of this stuff if you don't step up and do what we want.

So, um, yeah. But if Frank saw that bus, it was like, let me grab Eli and just throw him right under it. 100%. 100%. Uh, so they go in front of the judge and the argument, the judge here again, is BB new Earth legend. No, not here. Not in this case. Not here. Not here. The judge here is [00:11:00] legend in her own rights. Yes.

Because she's been in the courtroom pretty much my entire life. Uh, yes. S sorry, SES Epatha, uh, Merkerson. Yes. Yes. She always throws me off. Um, yeah, she has, she's been, she's been in, in the procedural game for a minute. Uh, lot. She was the lieutenant on law and order for like many years. Uh, was, she's also on Chicago Med, Marissa, who I think that's, that's one of your Chicago shows and who can forget Ruby, uh, Reba and PeeWee's Warehouse.

Yes, exactly. Back in the back in the day. Days. Exactly. Exactly. So she is there listening to this nonsense pretty much, and she's like, the argument here is if discovery is needed, and Josh is basically saying we can't trust. The Eli team with evidence, and I'm gonna show you why, because I'm gonna put Frank Lando on the stand.

So he puts Frank on the stand. He is like, yes, it [00:12:00] conspired with Eli co-conspirator. So that's key for the, for the charge. Um, and, and Josh is like, and then you came to me. 'cause you if you're guilty conscience, right? And you like really wanted to clear your name and then, or Frank is like, yeah, Uhhuh.

That's exactly what happened. And then he goes on to say that like when Eli came out or found out, he swapped his keys and else was like, oh my goodness. Oh no, your keys. It's like sbe. But this is Josh's line to say like they can't be just trusted with discovery. So Elsbeth takes this and says, okay, there are other ways to get the information I need.

Hey, Frank, I know you just got back from court and you're going into your office again after coming back from court, but here's a subpoena because we are, we are, um, suing you for defamation. So play here is to use that defamation case to get the information that you needs. Smart, smart, [00:13:00] smart. Because we have, we have to figure out number one, like, what is this?

This whole buying votes thing because Eli, Eli, for his part is like, I have really no idea. What they're talking about, what this is, I got nothing. So we gotta figure out what the, what they're claiming. When did Eli buy votes? Who do, who are they claiming he bought votes from? So to figure this out, we're gonna put Frank on the stand to make him talk about what, what, what He knows what he said, who, who he involved in this buying vote scheme.

So we know how to play defense on this, right? 'cause we already got him on the record saying he conspired with Eli. Right? So we gotta figure out what this, what the situation is he's talking about. So, and, and El Smith being the genius she is, comes up with like another genius idea out on how to do it. Yes.

So, and it works, right? Like she goes into court and they're arguing, arguing, arguing. Gets to the point where Frank's team is like, Hey, we're gonna move for dismissal with cause and out of nowhere Josh Prody [00:14:00] s up, like he's, he's been waiting for this. She's like, no, you don't wanna do this. And um, they have kind of like ERC.

Alicia a coming and playing like lawyer in this, in this case. Um, and Alicia's like, well, Josh just wants to use this for his purposes. Josh's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. This is the other way around. I am a USA Karate from the Department of Justice, which gets this judge not on the, on his side because it's like, that's great.

Shut up. Yeah. I like Judge Mark Marks. We've seen Judge Marks before. He was, I think he was involved in one of the chum home suits. Yes. Where they were trying to, like, they were trying to nerd explain to him what an algorithm was. He's like, I know what an algorithm is. You need, you need to nerd explain to me.

So this is like really great. One of those great no-nonsense judges. He's almost like, he's almost kinda like a questa. Like, I dunno if we're ever gonna see Questa again. Yeah. But he's kind of like, he's kind of in a quest of vein of like, don't BS me. Like I know what I'm talking about. You, you're not gonna do, you're not [00:15:00] gonna grandstand here.

You like, he has no time. For Josh Otti at all. He's like, I don't care who you are, who you are, where you are from, I don't care. Right. Use is my courtroom. As long as you love me, as long as you love me, as long as you're here in my courtroom, you're gonna do what I say. I don't care about your little, uh, federal lawsuit, whatever.

He has some point. He's like, I hate the Department of Justice. You're on. It's the nice already my guy, I was like, cheering so hard. I was like, yes. A judge on the stands saying they hate the do oj More of it. We need it. We need it. Oh yeah. This is just the TV show. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So pride kind of on the back foot, uh, already with this here because, and, and you, as you mentioned, they went to Alicia like, Hey, Alicia, like, we kind of need your help a little bit.

And because it's like, oh, we can't help you. It's in federal court, right? And they're like, no, no, no, no. We're gonna civil court Sue Frank for defamation. So that way he has to reveal all his information in civil court. She's like, so you want me. To go, to go in front of the court in the civil suit, kind as a sham lawyer.

Jump cut. This is [00:16:00] not a sham, your Honor. It was so good. Oh, that was so funny. So hilarious. Um, but yeah, so like, we're, we're like, all right, Frank, you got babe, what you come on. And also like when the judge is like, shut up Josh. She like, looks back and looks at Josh. She's like, Hey, got you here. Got you here.

Yeah. So Frank's on the stand and um, he's like, buying boats isn't defamatory. Like, I don't know why I'm being sued with defamation. Well, because he's, because it's true. It's not defamation. It's true. They're like, okay, it's true. So, so situation again, Josh can't like, keep his mouth shut. So he stands up and he is like, this is gonna hurt my case.

And the judge is like, I could don't care. Give two shit. Like I don't care. And. The question of, okay, it could be true, but I was just like, how is it true? Like, how do you know you arranged in the meeting, Josh is like, no, don't say it. Don't do anything like giving the no, giving the no. And the judge is like, Frank, you're gonna have to [00:17:00] answer this.

And so he does give up the name of Hughes Saxton, who is the retirement center. I remember when Jackie was given that speech at the retirement center and we were like, what the heck is she doing there? Uh, well this had something to do with it. Um, and basically what comes outta this is that Frank says that Eli was worried about the straw poll.

So Hugh had 600 seniors. Kind of bust in mm-hmm. To help Peter during the straw poll. Peter, love your husband, Alicia. Oh, yeah. Frank does Throw it out here like your husband, ma'am. Um, I do love the callbacks of like, oh yeah. Like, remember the straw poll. Remember, remember Jackie being, uh, shipped off to senior citizen homes to, to speak, uh, which is kinda like a punishment from Eli to be like, kind of like, get her as involved as he could.

It was like, all right, I'll just send her to senior homes Fine. Which is like, I love the callbacks to all these things that, that were happening that are now gonna be even more important than they were before. Yeah. The show does the really good jo, like, if you like. [00:18:00] Lore. This is good show for you because there's a lot, a lot to connect, uh, Alicia's connecting dots here, and she is not happy.

So back at the office, she's like, you packed the vote. And Ellizabeth is like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's not, let's not only get this conversation right now, because anyone could be subpoenaed and Alicia is like, I don't care. I will find some way to claim privilege. And Eli is here going, I just do what everybody does.

Mm-hmm. Like, I don't know what, I don't understand what's going on. I, it just happened to be that there was like a deal for crisis management with the retirement home. At the same time, coincidentally, when we were talking about having seniors blessed in for the straw poll, they're not connected in any way, shape, or form.

It's just a coincidence. But I, you know, I kind of would believe that because like if Eli, I don't think this isn't a crime to be like while I'm here, do y'all need any crisis management? Right. Uh, work or support. [00:19:00] Uh, which I, I, I, I shudder to think what a retirement home needs a crisis manager for. Oh, I can think of some things.

Yeah, probably. I don't like those things. I don't like those things. No, I don't like them either. Um, but yeah, I was like, I mean, listen, I was, I was there. I was like, Hey, while we're talking about seniors and voting, you need some crisis management help maybe. So I was like, I have to like, hang up the phone.

Pick up the phone again. Okay. Now we can talk about that. Like, walk out the door and then come back into the door. Like, and hey, as I'm just, I'm a crisis manager, walking door to door, just figured, you know, I'd come talk to you guys. Separate meeting. Separate meeting on your calendar. That way the, uh, the unfortunate phrase of Chinese wall was being, yes, yes.

And so, yeah, I, I, I don't think, I don't think Eli thinks he did anything wrong here, which I, I just, well, and I think that this is also, at least what they're trying to convey unfortunately to the audience, like this is a perception of how business [00:20:00] works in Chicago. Like there's a lot of quid pro quo, there's a lot of, I know a guy, you know what I mean?

And that is kind of true. Like this city was built by people. They know people. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, I, I don't think that's a unique situation of Chicago, but whenever it's portrayed in media and everything, it's always like, oh, there's some sort of coercion or some corruption. I'm not saying that there wasn't in our past.

I'm not saying that that wasn't there. Well, there definitely was. There definitely. I'm like prove that there was risk. Not saying that that didn't happen. However, I'm trying to say that not everyone prescribes to that way of business. Yeah. Uh, and do I think Eli tried to pack the vote? Absolutely.

Absolutely. Absolutely. But I feel like that's kind of fair game, right? Like, you know, as, as we'll see later, it wasn't, it wasn't exactly like that nefarious. Yeah. It was just like, I just want to, you know, make sure there are people that can get to the polling centers, right. Uh, if they so happen to be voted for Peter, great.

If not, [00:21:00] it is what it's also great. Yeah. So Kalinda goes and meets with Hugh the retirement Hu home man. And he's like, listen, I have a deal with the DOJ. Like, can't really talk about this. And while Kalinda iss there, she notices there's a picture of all of these seniors in different colored t-shirts from the straw poll.

So, cut to going into the courtroom, they have few on the stand. Elsbeth asks about these photos. And he confirms that he did arrange for transportation for the seniors to get to the poll. Um, but look, look at the shirts. Everyone's in different shirts. Shirts equal the candidate which they voted for, were like petitioning for.

So therefore, this wasn't a direct benefit to Peter in the strong poll. Um, well, and you, he also admits that there was never a deal made. Right, exactly. There was never like an actual quid pro quo that happened. Like, so this cannot be a conspiracy. So the judge again, she's like, well, we're about to just like, I got nothing [00:22:00] we're gonna have to do.

She got the gavel raise like halfway up. Yeah. He's like, about to dismiss case like, Josh's like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Hold on. Hold, hold, hold on. Hold on. I, I got one more. I got one more. I, as much as I do not like this character, I did enjoy this little scene and her scenes in this. Uh, episode, you know, when when Jackie appeared on the screen on my tv, I heard a scream that I felt like I could hear all the way from Chicago.

I was like, what's that? That sounds like my friend Mar Is that Mar screaming like, oh, Jackie. I was, I was quite surprised. Oh, I, I guess I should have been surprised that Jackie popped up on the screen like, oh, Jackie, that's the other one. Jackie. Yeah, it's Jackie. But I love how she is like walking down the street, and then she like, gets recognized.

So she takes that in, is like, oh my gosh, you know me. Like, oh my gosh, I'm so special. Of course, of course. Like, do you need me to sign something? And she is like, you're served. So she arrives in court and Eli is like there to greet her. It's like, Hey, I [00:23:00] need to know, I need to know what you're gonna say. And she's like, I'm just gonna tell the truth.

And Eli's like, Alicia, like Baff phone to Alicia, like, Hey, I need you in court. She's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. On my way, on my way. I, I knew that Jackie whisperer in court. Yeah. Get Jackie on the stand and she's sworn in. And of course she has to say that she is the mother of Steve's attorney, Peter Florick and future governor.

And I'm just like, oh my God. Oh my God. Um, she does testify that she did give a speech in Northbrook and when asked what it was about, she's arthritis and Jewish stuff. Goodness. Which she tries to explain to the court what a Seder is and what the Sabbath is. Um, so at this point Eli leans over, so Alicia's like, she's getting me back for everything.

Or to sba like, she's getting me back. She's, ELs was like, for what? It is, like everything for everything. And um, she also says on the [00:24:00] stand, like, Hey, you know, like. Eli says, it's not good for me to get involved in politics, so I just, I just listen, you know, just really twist. She's really twisting a knife to Eli.

Like, I just listen and Josh says, like, was there an agreement? She's like, uh, and he's like, an agreement about, you know, buying votes. Like, yeah, that sounds about right. That totally sounds about right. Whatever you said, that's what happened. So out in the hallway, Alicia's like, uh, we can totally impeach her because she's not a reliable witness, because she had a stroke, and Eli's like, oh yeah.

Good thinking Alicia. Good thinking. But you gotta be careful because she doesn't like talking about it and she hates me. And also the Jewish stuff. Uh, so Elizabeth gets Jackie on the stand like, Hey, so good to see you. Like, where did you, like, what'd you talk about in the speech? And Josh is like, why is that relevant?

Like this is, is nothing like, he's like, why is it relevant that she talked about the retirement age in her speech that day?[00:25:00]

Jackie's like, yes, I talked about the retirement age and other things obviously. And I was like, wait, you, you testified that after that speech you had a conversation with Hugh and Eli about a quid pro quo. And Jackie, I mean, everyone, everyone on the team is like prepared to like make Jackie look like she is not a reliable witness.

But Jackie just kind of like offers this up. And her response to that question is, I, if you say so. You know, I go to a lot of these events for my son Peter, and they kind of, kind of all just like blur together. Yeah. Suffered a stroke. And Eli and Alicia are like, did you, it was like, did you? And she, uh, actually says on the stand, you know what, Beth, there are days where I can't even remember my own name.

I was like, damn, what, what surprise. It's the, the looks between Alicia and Eli are, are interesting, right? Because it's like both of 'em are [00:26:00] like, wow. Like we just like, we kind of like lucked out here. Also, I think it's kind of like, wow, we should kind of worry about Jackie, right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like, uh, we haven't paying attention to what's going on with Jackie and this is not good.

Well, and also, like Jackie used this to basically get Eli to trust her more, to put her in front of like, she's basically showing him I know what the situation is. I think she played this, I think she's like, I think she played this. 'cause at the end when he says, why did you do that? She's like, it's the truth, isn't it?

I mean, I just think it was, I think it was a moment of vulnerability, right? It was a moment of like, uh, I still don't think she had this stroke. Oh my God, you, you're still on that. You are, you still don't think she had this stroke after we saw her see non-existent cockroaches. You are still like, nah, she's faking it.

She's faking. I, I thought this was just a moment of like, vulnerability of like, I, I think she, and then she got caught kind of flatfooted to be [00:27:00] like. Listen, I, I don't wanna do the facade anymore. I got problems. Like, I can't remember stuff, this and that. I don't think there's anything that's like bail eliel.

I always just like a moment of like, I, um, listen, I watch and see what happens because I have a feeling she will be like, Hey, Eli, remember that one time I did that thing. Remember that? I don't think there's, I don't think there's, I think there's, I don't think there's ever gonna be like a non moment where she's like, Hey, I helped you.

I kind of helped you out. I th but I think in this moment it was like, I can't even fake a fuck no more. Like, there are problems, I can't remember nothing in speech. I can't even remember that day. I can't even remember my old name half the time. So it's just like, I think whoever is questioning her at the moment, 'cause you saw, you saw when Josh was questioning her, she was just like, yeah, yep.

Whatever you just said. Sure. Like, she doesn't even know what to do in this moment. Yeah. But she really leaned in there by saying, there are days where I can't even remember my own name. I think she like, I think she may have pivoted in that, that like, she is smart. The thing about Jackie is that. She's annoying.

Yeah. Yeah. But she is [00:28:00] smart and she knows how to manipulate things in situ, like to her favor. And so I think she saw what, like an opening in terms of what she could do, because Eli's respon like her, his head goes down, he's like, oh, she got me. Like, uh, crap. Rebuttal, your Honor. Rebuttal. Um, I think, I think if Jackie was that smart, she would see this as an opportunity.

So like, but she did, I no, to, to get Eli out of there, like, to be like, oh no, I get Eli sent up the river for a no. He needs, she knows that Eli is what Peter needs to become governor and that's all she wants in this life is to be the mother of the freaking governor. I think credit, I telling you, I credit she deserves, but I, but, and I also thought like when she goes, that's the truth, isn't it?

Like the truth of like, I can't remember my own names. Sometimes I thought, I think Eli in that moment is like, oh yeah, I've been picking on a, I've been picking on an old and firmed lady. Like, oh, I don't know. Well, I don't, I don't know. We'll have to see. Uh, the, I just, I will always, listeners watchers you give us your, your opinion on this.

Yes. Let us know. Let us know. Are you team, are you team [00:29:00] Jason, a KE team Wright, or are you team Oh, are you team Mar comments? Objection. Objection. First of all, the uh, counselor is not even using the correct name of the opposing counsel. And also, um, he is. Influencing and intimidating the jury. So therefore I move for dismissal.

I Right. Okay. Anyways, so Elba you the comments. Hashtag team Jason. Hashtag team Mar. Okay. Jason, JSON, Mar, MAR. Team. Jason, ISSC Mar, M-A-R-I-S-S-A, Mar A. Hey. Hey. Issa. Marissa. Bar Issa, uh, says, okay, well, uh, Jackie's testimony is out and Frank's testimony isn't enough and I have no choice, but she got, the guy weighs again.

Midway up Josh was like, I can get you another witness in 24 hours. Oh my God. Here we go again.[00:30:00]

Oh, so else what This like, fine, we still got this defamation suit. I'm gonna put you on the stand, Mr. Formidable. Josh ti like, let's get you on the stand. And Josh like. All of this is being used to obstruct a federal case. Again, the judge in this case is like, I don't care. Like I don't care. Uh, if it isn't true, you like, isn't it true that you failed to prove this in federal court?

Like, he's like, yeah, for the moment. And so doesn't that mean that Frank was disqualified as a co-conspirator? It's like, yeah, but I'm not gonna say anything. And the judge again is like, you're gonna have to say something. And he names Diane Lockhart, blah, blah, blah. Yes. So they put Diane on the stand and they're like, Hey, did you initial this invoice?

And she's like, yeah. And Josh is arguing here that like under coercion, it's either about services offers offered or services received. And this is about services offered because [00:31:00] there was a discount on the bill too. Well, it was specifically for Eli's services. Yes. Yes, exactly. And she answered yes, that she initialed it.

But then she was asked, did you approve it? And she said, no, I did not approve it because my supervisor approved it, blah, blah, blah. Clark to the rescue again here. Yeah. Uh, because Clark told her to sign it because, you know, discounting services was part of Clark's way of getting revenue back into, um, the firm and everything.

And so, uh, Spath walks away with the win here and Josh is still pursuing her at the end of the day saying, Hey, do you wanna go to dinner? And ELs was like, Nope. No. Well, she actually, she thinks about it for like a long beat. She's like, Hmm hmm. And she's like, no, good. I'm glad for this. I good for you, Elsbeth.

But also it was fun to see her spar with Josh, so hopefully he comes back. I don't know. I, it looks as though Elsbeth has [00:32:00] at least put this case to bed for now, for, for the time being. I, I think this is probably the, the last of this specific thing. Um, I Do you, would you like to, I don't, has comic law often been on Ellsworth yet?

I'm trying to, Ooh, I'm trying to remember, like, no, has he been cast as a, as a murderer, as a different character? No, the show, I mean, I think this would be a really fun callback to be made via Ellsworth for, to have Common Glo will come back as Josh ti um, and, and Spar with Ellsworth a little bit. Uh, I, I know you not the creepy vibes from him in this appearance, but, well, it was also 24.

Like, I would like to see if he is grown as a human, as a character. I, I would just love to see people interact with people as weird or weirder than Elsbeth in that world. Like, damn, s but we thought you were weird. This guy, this guy's also super weird. It would be interesting if she had to prove that he didn't do something and not like he did do something, but like he didn't kill someone or he.

[00:33:00] I guess it would always be kill someone because that's all they do on that show, but yes. Yeah, something like that. So that was the main case of the week. We have a couple of other things going on in this episode, including the debate that were going on. We saw that Diane was helping with debate prep, which was the little surprising.

She was acting as Maddy to Peter as they were, um, as they were preparing. And Peter is like, okay. Like, I don't know, ever since they changed these debates so that they're like town halls and like walking around the body placement of the candidate on the stage has become a thing. Like you could see this in the Hillary Trump debates.

Like Trump would like come up to Hillary and be like over towering her because he wanted to show that he was, you know, blah, blah, blah. This big manly man, and like all those bullying, bullying. Basically Jordan is like, Hey, you're kind of doing like, your, kind of looks like you're bullying Maddie here.

Like yeah. This is the, this is the pre like Trump Hillary debate. Yeah. Like, uh, [00:34:00] preview. Um, I, I do love Diane who this was like, this is an interesting pairing that, you know, we don't really get a lot, we don't really think about a lot. Yeah. It was like Peter, Peter and Diane here, like in the same scene interacting.

We don't get that a lot. And I love in the beginning of the episode where Diane is like watching a Maddie press conference and then Maddie's like trying to get at Peter's diversity and Diane's like mocking Maddie. Like, like, like she's like, I was like Diane. Well, I didn't know, like we didn't know where that was going, but now we know that she was there.

Like also watching that to prepare for her rehearsal for, yeah. And also it. It makes sense to me now because I'm just rethinking back to when like, Diane interacted with Maddie a while back and Maddie was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Give me Alicia instead of you Uhhuh. Exactly, exactly. Oh yeah. That's why Diane hates mad.

Uh, which also made be the reason she decided to, you know, go ahead and do this for Peter, which is like kind of be a kind of, uh, sub for, for Maddie. Yes. Uh, while she's there, she also sees this as an [00:35:00] opportunity to kind of say, Hey Peter, aren't you looking for like a new firm to take over your civil cases?

Because apparently the bankruptcy bug is going around Chicago and a bunch of other firms are closing. Um, so we'll talk about what happens with that follow-up. But she does take the opportunity to feed. The idea and Peter's like, I'm gonna tell him you're interested. Yeah, that sounds great. Yeah. Also, I'd be like, Hey, but do you also remember when you were a state attorney, you tried to like, uh, make us turn over all of our stuff?

'cause you of our stuff Will of that. Remember that? Yeah, exactly. You owe us one. I think you owe us one bro. Exactly. But like I thought it was, I thought it was a fun sparring match in this faux debate with, with uh, with Diane. 'cause Diane is, Maddy is like, oh. 'cause we hear Peter at end of his little monologue be like, like doing his Peter thing.

I can tell you, oh my God, I couldn't gone prison under false corruption charges one time. I take it one time, I take it very seriously. I'm like, okay. And Diane Riley being like, oh, you hate corruption, huh? How about your guy Eli, right now who's facing corruption charges? [00:36:00] Like, ooh. And she kind of, she really kind of gets, gets Peter's goat in this moment and be like, and gets him flustered.

Yeah. You can tell that like Diane. Was definitely a debate kid. Like she loves it. Um, okay, so then like Peter and Alicia are like doing their thing in the trailer, whatever, and like, I know you love it. I, yeah. Well, we'll talk about why Alicia was all worked up, but she goes there and Peter's like, do you wanna have dinner?

And she's like, like, for the campaign? I was like, no. Like with me, like, this was so funny because on a date, because, all right, they just finished banging in the bus. It's just like, okay, cool. Elise's getting dressed. And then Peter's like, she's like, Hey girl, like you want, you wanna go out and like do something?

She's like, why? For what? Like. It's great. I love that part because Peter is like down hard, right? Like he is, uh, down bad. He's down bad. Yeah. That, yeah. He's so, he's like, oh my God, please just go to like, this means that we're together. Like he, in his mind, he's like, oh [00:37:00] my gosh, I'm gonna marry her again.

Like, we are so in love. You're so here. And she's just like, I was here for the thing at You're It, I am using you my G. But, uh, she's like, oh, that's like a date. He's like, no, he is like, I mean, but yeah, like a, a date. And she's like, oh, okay. I guess. So literally, literally thinking of you as like a relationship partner right now.

But I mean, I guess so. I, I love that it's a deal. I love that he wants it way more than she wants it in this moment of like, yes, I love that he's having to chase her, which is like, in the beginning of the series, it almost felt like he, he took this relationship for granted and then he lost it, and now he's like desperate to like, get it back.

Well, because she's only given him one, one big. Yeah. And he is gotta find out about the others. Uh, but in this, then he turns to debate strateg. He's like, well, you know, Jordan's telling me like that I look like I'm bullying Maddie on the stage. What do you think? She's like, I don't think anything. I think you've gotta call Eli.

Like, well, I haven't been talking to Eli. She's like, I know you, you [00:38:00] gotta call Eli. So, uh, he does call Eli in front of Jordan during debate prep, which was a little bit ballsy. And you, you can't, you, you can't be calling a sneaky link when, when you, when your, when your person's right there. Like, that's, come on, come on Peter.

You can't, you can't do that. Well, and he like, and Jordan links like, listen, you can't, there's, there can't be two captains. Eli would tell you the same thing. You can't do that. But then he goes a little far and he is like, Hey, do you trust me? Like, yeah, well gimme your phone. And Peter's like. I trust you, but like, I need my phone, bro.

It's never, it's never good when they ask to see your phone and you'd be like, no, you can't see my phone. Like, whatcha are you using my phone for? It's like, Ooh, no. The first, the first instinct is, here's my phone. Here you go. It's never, it's never good when you ask for the phone, they're like, why? For what?

Yeah. I don't do anything. And the John, uh, Jordan's like, uh, you know, to quote a famous, he doesn't say to, to quote, A famous movie is gonna come out pretty soon. I'm the [00:39:00] captain now.

Oh man. So, uh, that's what's going on. Pre, pre debates and then we get to debate day and Alicia's just like walking backstage and Maddie's like, wrong side. You're on the wrong side, wrong side of the building. You should go over there and this isn't gonna work. If Jordan sent you over here to like mess with me, it's not gonna work.

And I have to say Alicia's line here of people always ask if women and men can be friends, but the real question is, can women. Totally true. Totally, totally true. Really? It's hard. There are, yeah, there, yeah. It's mean Girls is a thing for a reason and there, there is so much internalized misogyny within women that sometimes, wow.

Being friends with women, being helping women is, I mean, there's a whole reason why there's like a whole campaign around like women help women. Like that's what women [00:40:00] do because we've been trying to compete with each other for all of this time and trying to like one up and doing all this stuff to get attention from men, all this stuff.

I could write a whole paper on it, but I was like, I bet you have. I bet you was like, yeah. In my head. In my head, look at your files. Yeah. Somewhere. With my fountain pen. Um, but like, Alicia's, like, what are you, like what? I'm just here. Like, of course I'm gonna be here. My husband's here. Like, I'm gonna be here.

I, um, you know, I did, I did not think that was gonna be your position on this. I, because I was, I was, when this, when this, when she said a line, I was like, Ooh, we're just gonna get her for that one. Because like, I thought you could be like, of course women can be friends. What are you crazy? I thought that was gonna be a thing, but you were like, Nope.

Dead on. Because it, you know, it just, it's, it's kind of like a, I was like, oh, Alicia, come on. Of course women can be friends, but you're like, no. Like, no, definitely not. Well, not when there's power in play. Not when there's sex in, like, sex. Some sort of sexual, like power. Like, [00:41:00] I don't know. It's like very few women can be friends with the ex of the person that they're like, they're dating.

Unless that person was really horrible and like they bond over the hate for that person. Um, but when there's power involved. Okay. It, it's really, I, I just know that in my career when I was in corporate, working for women and being helped by women was not as frequent as it could. Well, I, because I thought I did, especially when I worked for an organization, organization that is, was founded around the fostering of girl leadership and it, it kind of makes, and that also sells cookies.

It kind of makes sense for Alicia for sure in this show, in this series, because let, let's look at the track record, right? She had, she had some friends in her, uh, wives circle back in the day. Yep. They all left her when, uh, this whole scandal broke out in the beginning of the series. Yep. Those friends are gone.

She had Kalinda as a good friend. And you see how that turned [00:42:00] out? That's gone. We had Maddie, who apparently Maddie was just using her to, to, to pump her for information that's gone. So I, I think Alicia is founded right in the, in, in her, uh, kind of. Thought here of like, no women can't be friends. 'cause every woman friend I had turned out to go way wrong.

So. Well, and like those friends in the neighborhood were probably friends with her because of her proximity to power. Yeah. Peter Power. Yeah. Um, yeah. So I, I guess in, in her case, in her specific case, this makes, says, but I, the thought of it to me when she says like, oh, come on, that's so, like, that's so stereotypical.

That's so like, women can't be friends. I'm like, oh. I'm like, of course women can be friends. And then I get on with the Bri. Like, no, they cannot. They cannot. No. I mean like you can't, but like, again, power, like the power thing is like, will I do something to help advance a woman over me? Yes. Am I like a lot of women?

I don't know. Like I think there's been a changing of the tide, especially in 2012, that was not the culture. I think we have moved to a [00:43:00] culture of women helping women. It just wasn't there. And I guess we're in 2013 in the show right now, but, well, Marissa, I'm so glad you said that. I'm so glad you were, you're all for.

Powering women. Yeah. Uh, giving women a, a hand up in the job structure. Where are you going? What are you gonna do? Where are you going? Jennifer? Jennifer, Jen. I, I hired an intern. Uh, Jennifer, come on in. Oh, okay. Come on Jennifer. Come on in. This is, let, let's, would you like to learn about podcasting? I'm more than happy to help you.

She's gonna sit in, break into the podcasting world. That's, she's gonna sit in a couple episodes. You know, she's gonna, I mean, she might, she might like guess co-host sometimes. Okay. When you, when you're too busy, you know, have so much fun putting those episodes up without me. Like, I think that's so great.

I think, you know, I, I'm all for more women voices on podcasts. Believe me. That is something I am all for. Uh, I just wanted to mess with you a little bit. I was like, oh, wait, wait, wait. No, no, no. Always turning tables, uh, [00:44:00] forever turning tables. Yeah. So, I mean, interesting comment. I would think like, also I'll, I'll tell us this one to the listeners too.

Do you think that the culture has changed, um, if you identify as a woman, um, between the early two thousands, mid the two 2010s, whatever you wanna call them, and, and now, because I think back then it was definitely like, and even like, we see this with Diane too on the show as well. Like, Diane doesn't have a lot of women friends.

Like she's, she's definitely, you know, always climbing a ladder, doing something to try, try and get again, proximity to power. Yeah. And we've seen her have that struggle of like. Uplifting women, but like, not above me though. Like Yeah, exactly. Like, welcome Alicia. I'm so glad. But also, you're gonna have to pay your dues and you're gonna have to, like, I'm not gonna try to make it easier for you because you're, I, you're gonna have to go through the same exact thing that I did.

I, I'll uplift women to write under my level. Yeah, exactly. Like we can be [00:45:00] like, as long as they can see the top of your head, we're cool. Yeah. Uh, okay. So, uh, debate night and Maddie is leaning in on immigration and I dunno, like Peter says this stupid thing, he's like, immigration is a complex issue, which is a way of not even talking about it.

And then he says, we are Illinois, not Arizona, meaning we're not a border state. However, we do have a lot of immigrants, which make our state great. But anyway, Maddie takes this as an opportunity to lean in and it's like, okay, well if you're, I'm so glad you found the Latino vote. Like how many, let's talk about the diversity of your office.

And he's like, yeah, I'm working on it. I'm working on, and she's like, yeah, but you knew about this. This was brought to your attention two years ago and you haven't done anything. And backstage, uh, Jordan's like, how'd she know that? She's like, for me, she's using all this stuff for me. Which again? I, I mentioned this last episode.

Like how much, how much did they talk? Yeah, exactly. When they Exactly, when they were friendly. Like Maddy's, like, by the way, girl. Uh, just, just us two girls [00:46:00] here. Gavin over wine. What's your husband's like? Diversity rate? Yeah. It's like, I, I just wanted to, Maddy, I've been like super, like trying to hide it, but not really like, so how many, how many African Americans would you say Peter hires girl.

I mean, if this was girl talk, like in the 2024 campaign, it would be like, and in the office we have all of the, the non-white essay state's attorneys in the, would you please stand up so that everyone could see? It's like, what, what percentage would you say your husband has, like, like, you know, non-white workers and just, just, you know, just you and me just talking.

Just, just girls. I mean, she could figure that that's probably public knowledge, but yes. I mean, they, like, who knows what the heck they cover from a lot of ground. She got a lot of like, she got that from two years, the two years that, that she knew about it two years ago that she got from Melissa. Well, its like she got that from me.

It was like, what Y'all just are gabbing about your husband's like, uh, hiring practices. I, I mean also Alicia, maybe you don't need to be [00:47:00] talking about that. Yeah, probably not. And you can see here, like Peter is trying to follow Jordan's instructions, right? Basically just make it to the end. You just, by being yourself, you're gonna be okay.

But he is like not fighting back. He's kind of just sitting back and Maddie is like up in the camera thing, like, I will fight for you Illinois. Like, uh, this is what I will do. Um, Petra, you like Peter, do you want to say anything about what she just said about your hiring practice? He's like, no, no, I don't think I will.

It's like, wow. Okay. Yeah. So Jordan's like, this is great. All we need to do here is like, mostly good. Yeah, mostly good. Because Peter comes off stage. He is like, I mean, it's, it is like a break. Peter comes, say, she's like, like, Alicia, like, what's going on? What's that? Am I doing okay? She's like, um. Mostly good Jordan Jordan's like, that's what you want.

Mostly good. It's like, okay, bro. Just, well, he's like, like he's not wrong. Like Peter has a position in the pulses. He doesn't need to like blow her out of the water or anything like that. Yeah, that's he, that's true. He needs a [00:48:00] mostly good, however, that Alicia knows that this is not in Peter's character and this is definitely not the advice that e Eli would be like saying, lean in, lean into who you are, not just like float through this debate.

Yeah, so always just like Jordan, I have a question for you. Peter, go call Eli. Like right now, go do it. So Peter uses us, three minutes, gets Eli on the phone, and Eli has like very sound advice, especially for someone who knows Peter as well. Like, you bland out when you don't punch back, like no one's really gonna pay attention to you, like you're gonna disappear on the screen.

He's like, yeah, but Jordan tells me like, I can't get, like, get next to him or next to her because it'll look like I'm bullying. Bullying. He's like, just don't get in the frame. Like, you have to be aware of the camera, not just the people in the, the, um, audience, which I think also shows how, how experienced plays into this, like Eli is thinking about cameras.

Jordan was basically [00:49:00] thinking about the people in the room. Like there is still that experience gap between the two of them. And at the end of this conversation. Peter's like, man, Eli, I forgot about good. How good you are at this. And Eli's like, thanks, like I really miss you calling the shots here. And he's like, I miss you too, bro.

It's, it's such a tender moment. It's like, man, I miss you so much, man. It's like, I miss you too. I miss you. It wasn't like, it was like, it was like, yeah, I, I, I miss, I miss working for you. He is like, I miss you. Like, yeah. Yeah. It was, yeah. It's basically like, um, Alicia and Peter, right? Like, Peter's like, I want you, I want everything with you.

And Alicia's like, I just want, I just want sex. I don't wanna, Nikki, you're not, and this, that whole conversation is happening while like Josh is on the stand. Yeah. Eli's case. Um, so there comes an opportunity in the debate where Maddie [00:50:00] says. You have spent the last X amount of years being a politician, and I have been a business owner and that's what makes me different.

And then Peter, like, it's like a superhero, like pause, you know, where it's like, do I do the thing? Am I gonna do the right thing? Blah, blah, blah. So he stops and he like, then he gets up and he is like, speaking of being a business owner, um, yeah, closed up shop in Schaumburg. You, uh, which shout out Schaumburg.

Um, and then you outsourced a bunch of your other stuff. She's like, oh wait, wait. Like I didn't do that. I also created a bunch of jobs. And all this stuff's like, well you also union busting. Like that's not cool, especially in the state of Illinois, big union state, big union, town of Chicago. It's not great.

It's not great. Um, and Jordan's like, what is he doing? It was just like he's trying to win. And what I loved at the end of this scene, even though I hate Peter, um, is. At the end, Maddie's like, wait, I thought this was the question about something, not about me. And she is like, in the [00:51:00] center of the frame. And you see Peter walks behind, sits on his stool and is like, really like leaning to get into the frame.

Gotcha. Yeah, I thought that was funny. Um, and at the end of the day, it looks like the public agrees that Peter won the debate. And Peter is, or Eli is packing up back at the office because he has a liability at this point and Christina's gonna use all this stuff. And Peter's like, do you want something sentimental?

It's like, I don't care, bro. Here's a handshake and a hug and a, a handshake and a hug. He's like, Ooh, we back, we back. I gotta say it's no, um, Bartlett for America. If you're a West Wing fan, you get it. But you know, here's the other thing. He does say like, I can't get to Springfield. Without you and Eli's like, or Washington, and I'm just like, oh my God, please, no, please, no, please, no.

But Eli ends up staying, he ends up [00:52:00] unpacking like we knew he would, but yeah. I mean, you know, because like Pete Eli won, right? Eli Peter both get wins here, but Eli's is just like, yeah, I guess I technically won, but it's like there's still stuff in the air about me. And like he doesn't, yeah, he doesn't want, he doesn't want his bro Peter to suffer for, for his, for his stuff.

Peter's like, I don't care, bro. I need you Just snotty. Just try. Well, he's basically saying like, Christina's gonna use whatever, whether you're working for me or not. So you might as well work. Well, I mean, S's gonna use the Eli stuff no matter what, one way or the other. Even though he won. But the, the, the charge, the accusation is still out there.

That's what Eli's saying, like, he's gonna use that. He's like, I don't give a crap. I need you, bro. Get back on board, baby. Here's a hug to to, to cement this thing. Yeah. So yeah. Eli is back. Baby. PPTP. Tai. No, no e um, E leader eater. E leader. [00:53:00] E leader. E leader is back. They're, they think they're so elite. There you go.

I like that. Leader is back for good. The, the Bash bros are back, baby. Oh boy. Oh boy. Uh, we also have a couple other things before we wrap up this episode. Um, one I wanna talk about with you, Jason, is the fact that Alicia and Will had colds, bro, that was freaking hilarious. And the fact that the cold lasted like.

Half the episode and then they were just, both just fine. Was funny. But just the fact that like, 'cause Alicia comes to Diane's office, she's like, Hey, what's up girl? It's you. It's you. I was like, oh, okay. You got a problem? Will comes in. He's also got it. I'm like, oh my God, this is so funny. Y'all caught the same cold 'cause y'all been swapping.

Y'all swap, spit for like a second and you caught a cold and like post 2020. Mia is like, stay home. Like come to work, stay home. And Diane's like, don't go anywhere near me, Dan. Diane don't even clock it. [00:54:00] Diane's like, Dan's like, oh, you guys stay away from me. Like no more. Like, y'all should stay away from each other.

Like, she's like, no, stay away from me, but your colds. But they, okay, so remember they had the kiss and they're like, we can't be next to each other, blah, blah, blah. There was a scene also where they found themselves in an elevator. Mm. And will's like, don't worry Alicia, it's fine. We're not gonna do Also like, I don't understand this elevator ride.

'cause right now they really only have one floor and like the elevator opens and Alicia sees Will and she's like. Hesitating to get on in the elevator. And so she gets on the elevator and will's like, cool, cool. We're gonna be okay. We're gonna be okay. And then she leaves the elevator and he stands on the elevator.

Yeah. Where are you going? Like, where are people going? Like, I don't understand this at all, but I, I'm always, my, my interest is always peaked when Alicia will are in an elevator for sure. Yeah. I, I loved when Alicia get in, like the elevator, like this is right after she's dealt, she's dealt with the other A and b plots.

Like they get, they get, they hit her three times in a row with the a b plot, and then boom, will's [00:55:00] here in the elevator. She's like, oh crap, we gotta deal with this again. And then like, we're like, listen. I know, I know. Last episode we said we had to totally avoid each other, which was just. Nonsense. We, so it is like now he's like, we, we just can't avoid each other.

Like it's too much. Yeah. I mean, it's like a really tense moment. And it, it's right after this that Peter and Alicia are banging on the bus. Yes, exactly. Exactly. So this tells you, it's like when I got, when I have a will temptation, I need to go banging out with Peter. Well, where there's the will, there is a way's where there's the will, there's a Peter.

Because like in order to to, to get my a tension and, and Sexualness frustration. Yeah. I need an outlet. That outlet right now is Peter, because Peter's the only kind, real acceptable person I could bang it out with right now because, and Peter's just like, oh my God, she loves me again. Yeah, bro. Like, oh poet, it ain't you my guy.

It ain't you. It ain't you, it ain't you. She's thinking about which, you know, we were, we were debating, you know, the other, the other episode about like, [00:56:00] because we had that little flash of something and then Alicia's like. All were clamped in the morning. We're like, what was that? Was that a dream? What, what was it?

I'm thinking it's a dream about Will Will always. Yeah. Yeah. Still thinking about Will. I was like, oh, that's, yeah. Well I told you they were on a bed. They weren't in the bathroom. Like, true. That is how, you know the bed deserved for Will. Yes. Uh, so yeah, that was, huh? Fricking hilarious to have this cold shared between them.

It's like, it's like, oh, you gave me your cold. And the looks between them of, of guilt of like, oh, I gave you my cold. Oh shit. Like, oh crap. Oh crap. Well, and Alicia, like you had mentioned, is really getting put through the ringer in this episode as well, because Diane has kind of said, oh, welcome. You're an equity partner now.

So great. So good to have you. Um, here's some responsibility. You have to look at the Bishop case, and we are charging, are we charging too much? I think we might be charging too much. Like, like thing billables are high. Billable hours are high. Why don't you go look into that? So this puts [00:57:00] Alicia in this very awkward position of going to work with the bishop team who is being headed by no, other than cargos.

It carries like, I got everything prepped. We're here. And Alicia walks into the meeting and she's like, but do we really need all of this? And carrie's like, we voted on it, like we're we're ready to go. It was so funny for many reasons, right? Because like Alicia walks into the room and carrie's like, oh, everybody, uh, Alicia.

Just got a name to partner. Let's give, let's give her a round of applause. Give her a round of applause. Hey, like golf class, Alicia. And she's like, Uhhuh. Yeah. Great. Um, do we, like, is this all necessary? He's like, I mean, you thought it was necessary like two days ago when you were just in here with us.

Like, he's like, because she's like, we don't need this and this. She's like, but you came up with that. Like that was your idea. Well, and then it was just like, uh, maybe there's like a more conservative way that we can approach this and Kira's like, do you wanna head that up? Yeah. And Alicia's like, I guess so.

[00:58:00] Yeah. Do you wanna do that Alicia? Do you want to, uh, do all the stuff you're talking about here is like, since you're hassling me about this and because Alicia's like, yeah, we need to, to take off one of these motions. Carrie's like, okay, um, let's vote who, who thinks we should get rid of one of these motions?

No one votes for it. And like, and Carrie kind stares with Alicia like. What now What are you gonna do? What are you gonna do? Oh, and like I, this was, this is the, the, the great thing about making Alicia partner is the, is pretty much the like silent face offs with Carrie and how is it gonna go? Yes. Yeah.

And basically, Diane again in her mentorship of women is basically like, um. Alicia, you need to assert your authority here. And Alicia's like, look, we don't like, we need all of these things. It is my authority to tell you that we need these things. Like, I don't dunno what else to do. And Diane's like, no, no, no.

We, your a author. What we [00:59:00] need to do here is find a way to cut 10% of billable hours. Respect my a authority. And it's like, it, it's, it's a classic 'cause I've been in this position, right where you get promoted from mm-hmm. One level to another. And now you have to interact with your one-time peers and be like, and you try to speak up, upper manage, like, no man, you don't understand your management.

Like, this is all needed. Like, no, you management now too. So you gotta understand that we don't, we, you gotta figure out a way to make it happen. Well, and yeah, like I was really surprised that she didn't say, Hey guys, I'm being, this is what I'm being told by management. How can we collectively. Come up with this, you know, like how can we change the thing here?

Because she said her whole thing to carry was, I can fight for you, right? Uh, like I can fight for you. I can do all this stuff. Which is classic, classic. We knew how this was gonna go. Um, but she does it. She takes this like authority and, and so afterwards she's like, okay, fine. I have to cut 10%. I don't really wanna face Carrie again.

I don't wanna be in that weird position. I'm just gonna [01:00:00] cut my own hours. And Diane is like, that is not good, Alicia, because clients like to see partner hours on their cases. So like, you're gonna have to like figure this out. You cannot pretend that you are their peer anymore. It's galling to me and it's galling to them.

And I was like, whoa, Diane. Like this is definitely, like I said, a very patriarchal way of management. I would be all like, Hey guys, we have a problem. How would you like to solve it? Like, together. Yeah, but that's, but that's not the, I agree with Diane here. Like it, you can't. You can't work with them like that.

You can't be their buddy while being their boss, because that is a very buddy way of like, Hey guys, like I'm, I'm really getting, I'm really getting, uh, put out here. What are you, what are you gonna do? Because they're gonna take advantage of you in that way. You're, you're friends, but at a certain point they're gonna try and take advantage of you, and you have to like, right.

That's how this, like, what my, what I'm arguing is that the system is wrong and we should have a way where that is how problems are solved as opposed to, I'm more on the being [01:01:00] hierarchical side. I mean, I'm more on the Diane side because like, yeah, you can't, you can't have both ways. You can't have your kick two, you can't be the boss and also be the work friend.

You have to put your, your foot down in some way because like, human nature is, if you are buddy buddy with your subordinates, they're gonna take advantage. It's not, it's not a, like, it's not a. Bad person thing. It's just human nature. If they, if they see a way to like get what they want through their friend, that's their boss.

Now they're gonna do it. So you have to kind of cut it off. I think there's like a difference though, between being buddy buddy with someone and then also saying like, hi, I'm in the room where this decision is being made. I want your voice to be heard. How can we, what do you think about the situation?

Give me information to take into consideration when I'm making this decision. It's really like, this is, this is why I did not work in corporate. Like this is why, this is why this did not, this is not where I put put a [01:02:00] lot of my stuff. But I do think there is a way, not that you can play both sides, but a way that you can and not be their friend, but take, take into consideration.

Their thought and feelings. It's a slippery slope and it's not easy to do. And I'm not saying that it like the best way to do business or anything like that, but I'm saying there has to be a way to do it differently. Yeah. But someone like Diane doesn't wanna hear that she Oh no, she doesn't. No, no, exactly.

Neither did any of my bosses or any of my other, yeah, she, she only wants to hear for sure. I've cut the hours. She only wants to hear, I've saved money in this way. A hundred percent. And, and so that's where Alicia finds herself. She finds herself in that like really like crappy, sticky, like gray area of having to supervise your one time peers that like this was a perfect encapsulation of that.

Well, think many of you have been. Diane knew she had to do this early to Alicia to like break the. Break the bond. And in the end, uh, [01:03:00] you know, Carrie sees Diane having this conversation with Alicia in their office and he goes back to the team. He's like, well, he is. The team's like, did seeing Alicia sign off on this stuff?

Like, well, you know, don't get on her bad side or whatever and will pops in. He is like, Hey, just check in, make sure everything's going okay. You know, and it's like, yeah, uh, and don't worry about the bill thing because Alicia cut her own hours. And everyone's like, oh yeah, I, I really enjoyed this. Because as Carrie and all the associates are like complaining and bitching about Alicia, I feel like will overhears them bitching about Alicia.

And he is like, like, as you say, like pops like, Hey guys, you know that, that, that woman you all were just complaining about, that you were all just bitching about. She cut her own hours, took money outta her own pocket to give to y'all. Okay. Like, I thought it was Will's way of being like. Watch it. Watch yourselves.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And Carrie, like, Carrie takes that as like, oh, she did it, right? Like, she stood up for us. She [01:04:00] mouth me. Yeah. Yeah. So she, he goes back in and he is like, Hey, we're good, right? Like, we're good here. Alicia's like, I got notes for you on the, on how, how you're doing the case and we need to have this ready at this time.

So she is finding a way because Carrie has brought up, brings up to Alicia during this entire time, like, it's not cool that you tried to cut our hours because it doesn't make me look good in times of promotion and I don't wanna have the rug pulled out for me for the second time. Alicia, like, more like, I, like a third time he's, he's already had it pulled out two times.

I was like, yeah, uh, I really love that. I was like, I wanna have the rug pull out from me again. Yeah. So at you really school, Carrie, at the end of the day, I think she is finding her way to assert her authority. Um, and she's just gonna have to find a way to do that and maybe also be on good terms or not friends or whatever.

She's still navigating those waters with Carrie. Yes, for sure. The other [01:05:00] thing that happened again, jam, jam packed episode was Will went to bid for the business of the state's attorney's office in civil cases. And I loved this entire thing because Will goes in, of course he's, he's like, will turned up to 11.

He's like, I know I only have 30 minutes, but I could talk about this for 30 days. Like, this is like all this stuff, any questions? And everyone's like, no, it's great. Like, and Geneva Pine herself, she's just like, this is fantastic. Great presentation. You can go like, great. And also we have in the room, Amanda, Pete.

Whose last name is Hellinger in the show by Laura Hellinger Hellinger. Laura Hellinger a great what, such a great last name. If I ever like write any piece of fiction or anything, I'm naming somebody Hellinger. She's like, I actually do have a question. Um, you work for Lamont Bishop, like the drug guy is like, how is that gonna work?

Working for the state's attorney and like [01:06:00] one of the largest drug dealers in Chicago. Like, there's this thing that we on the good wife, not we on the good pod, like to say exist called the Chinese wall. Don't worry about it. We won't like the paths, the streams will not cross. Um, we'll stay on our side of the fence whenever we're dealing with stuff.

Laura's like, that's not, that's not cool, will takes this entire thing because he's walking out of there thinking Geneva was a yes and Laura was a no. And so he goes up to Laura afterwards, like, what am I missing about this? Like, why did you do this? Why were you so hostile? And Laura's like, you idiot.

Geneva was against you. And I was asking the question to help you out so that you could explain yourself. I was like, no, she was, she was being polite. You idiot. You dork. I'm like, I'm trying to help you. So he like walks away, but then he comes back with a bottle of wine and Laura's like, I accept your apology.

I forgive you. And he's like, I wasn't apologizing [01:07:00] for anything. Like, did I say I was apologizing? So it looks as though there's some, some vibes still going on with those two. Um, in the end, the firm did lose or did not go further in the bidding, um, for the state's attorney's civil cases. Surprise, surprise.

Um, but. It looks as though there might be something more for Will and Laura, the Lukes, that they give each other all the time. The little bantering they got going on, like, and every time they're together now it's like, all right, y'all just, just effing get over with. Come on, come on now. Now it's gonna be real interesting once that does start and how like, at least you're gonna feel about this.

'cause like Will will have a cold and Laura will have a cold, and then Isha will be like, what? Hey, both of y'all got cold sore. What's going on? Yeah, we will see. Great episode. Really, really enjoyed this episode. It's a fun, fun time. We got Elsbeth, we got, uh, [01:08:00] Peter and Diane and Will and Hellinger and, and Alicia.

So much. Everybody, so much. A lot was going on. Uh, Marissa, now we've got the episode done and dusted. You wanna tell the folks out there where they can find you online, what you're up to? Uh, big news on the, uh, USS sisterhood, uh, front, I, I've, I've seen. Do tell, uh, we gotta drop. We got a whole, like, bunch of episodes just drops.

Okay. Here's the thing, Jason, when you're transmitting from space, okay, it takes a while to get tickets. It takes while it takes a while to get there. Yeah, exactly. Uh, yes, you can find some new episodes of the US Sisterhood in your podcast feeds or a link to the podcast. If you've never listened. You're, um, more than welcome to.

You can find it at it's me marissa g.com. Uh, you can also find links to our YouTube. If you're listening just on your podcast, you can find our YouTube channel linked there as well, uh, for the Good Pod. And then also I am on Whirlwind podcast talking about Pretty Little [01:09:00] Liars one previously honored at a time.

Um, and there are links there as well. Also, if you wanna follow me on Instagram, I've decided to sort of maybe use it for like my business. Maybe, I don't know. I talk a lot about like systems, which sounds boring, but I tried to make it fun like I really do. So if you want to follow me on Instagram, it, it's me, marissa g.com.

I got some new stuff. Or it's me, Marissa, g on Instagram. Um, I've got some new stuff going on there, so follow me in the places with the stuff and the things. Jason, what's going on with you over in Perfect Match Land? Yeah, you could find me and Aja Welch talking about the show Married The First Sight over on our podcast, A Perfect Match.

We are exclusively on Patreon right now because there is no, uh, new season that's come out that we usually do on the Rapid Podcast Network. So we are revisiting. Old seasons of the show, we are in season 10. Do you wanna rewatch that? It is one of the better seasons of the show, so [01:10:00] come on over to Patreon patreon.com/your Perfect Match podcast five.

Do five bucks a month, get you a whole big catalog of our very first site, Rees bonus, uh, episodes from season 19. If you like that show, you'll find a treasure trove of things over there for you to discover. Uh, that's pretty much it for me. Marissa, that's it for you. Uh, sorry, Mar, uh, until, until you hear from me.

And Mar next time, stay good. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

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